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Here we go again...Islanders could be Mets neighbors???

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  • mandrake
    replied
    http://www.newsday.com/sports/hockey...ark-1.14293712

    https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...-belmont-arena

    "The New York Islanders and New York City Football Club each want to build a new arena at the site of Belmont racetrack, pitting two of New York’s richest team owners against each other to build what might be the city’s last all-new venue for decades.

    Part-owned by the Yankees, NYCFC is looking for an alternative to its current home at Yankee Stadium. In its proposal to develop Belmont Park, which is due at 2 p.m. Thursday, the Major League Soccer club describes a 26,000-seat facility and an area set aside for fans’ pregame activities, according to a person who had seen the plans. The person asked not to be named because the information is private."

    The Wilpons, The Dolans, The Steinbrenners...... and the Islanders

    Leave a comment:


  • brooklynboy
    replied
    Fred uses the Mets as a downpayment on his business loans. Now that's spending on the Mets.

    Leave a comment:


  • PatNYM
    replied
    Good point about steering from the hockey. I have seasons now, have had them since 1998. Yes, if you were going when goalies did not have masks it was before I was born. I am 40. However, my response was more to the remark that the Rangers were "only 18th in attendance." Anyways, wasn't the idea thrown around when the plans for Citi were being finalized? However, Wang was more interested in his Lighthouse project and wasn't interested. Now, Isles have new owners, and there very well could be mutual interest. How much money Wilpon would be kicking in or if he is just planning on "selling" the land that is the parking lot on what used to be Shea?

    Leave a comment:


  • mandrake
    replied
    Originally posted by PatNYM View Post
    Look at the secondary market for Rangers tickets, then call the season ticket office and tell them you are interested in seats and see what they say. They can easily sell out 22,000+ a night.

    Having the Islanders or Devils move, wouldn't solve any issues for either team, attendance wise. Maybe a lot of Devils fans become Isles fans or vice versa, but very few are going to travel from NJ to games in Bklyn/queens/LI and the same from LI to NJ. If the Devils left, I would not expect more than maybe a handful of Devils fans to become Rangers fans, but in time Central and North Jersey would become Rangers territory again. So, you would have a case of one team that is in the same situation and the other with an even stronger foothold in the area. What would need to happen to have 2 strong fan bases in the area would be for the Rangers to leave. Not that it would ever happen, but then the Devils and Isles would have their suburban stronghold and they would eventually split the city fanbase. It would take a lot of time, as Rangers fans are not likely to root for either team right away, but eventually it would get there. Thinking back on it, had the city not offered the tax break on MSG and Gulf & Western (think they owned them at the time) had moved to Brendan Byrne like was feared, it is what you would probably see today. NJ and part of the city as Rangers fans, and LI and part of the city as Isles fans. The northern suburbs would likely split as well. On the west, closer tot he GW Rangers fans, on the east closer to the Throggs Neck and Whitestone as Isles fans.
    I don't want this to become a hockey thread since it will definitely get closed. roof:
    My wife and I had full season tickets in the old green seats sec 331. I am pretty familiar with the franchise, their popularity, and their secondary markets. I have been going to Ranger games since before their goalie wore a mask. I think I was probably sitting up in the blue seats before you were born.

    The Rangers are worth $1.2 billion . The Isles at $325 million and Devils at $330 million could relocate or fold tomorrow and 99% of the people wouldn't even know it. When these 2 teams are on TV, virtually nobody watches. The Isles averaged a 0.4 rating. That means 99.6% of people in Metro NY aren't watching. The Devils averaged 0.3 rating, meaning 99.7% aren't watching. Guess what, this means 99.3% of metro NY isn't watching the Devils or Isles combined. http://www.sportsbusinessdaily.com/J.../NHL-RSNs.aspx

    80% of all revenue in the NHL is generated by six teams: Rangers, Toronto, Montreal, Chicago, Boston and Vancouver. (The Canucks edged out Philly and Detroit.) The NY Rangers revenue in 2 years (they make about $230 million per year) is far greater than the value of either the Isles or Devils .

    No new arena for the Isles. They can either stay in Brooklyn, crawl back to Long Island , or relocate to Quebec. And as far as the NHL revenue is concerned, they can take the Devils with them.

    Now before the thread is closed , the discussion should talk about the Mets alleged involvement in an Islanders arena. I can't see Ebeneezer Wilpon getting involved with the bottom fish Islanders.


    Fact 1979, season tickets in the 'blue seats' were $240 each. 40 games, @ $6. 4 season tickets cost $960.
    In 2015 a friend offered me a pair of tickets ..freebies...with a face of $1,080.00 EACH. I gave them to my brother as I had some things to do (like digging out from a snowstorm, and I just didn't feel like going). Even with a chance to eat in the 1879 club, I passed.

    The Islanders and the Devils can only dream of revenue like this.
    Attached Files
    Last edited by mandrake; 07-27-2016, 10:37 AM.

    Leave a comment:


  • PatNYM
    replied
    Originally posted by mandrake View Post
    Metro NY has 2 football teams and 2 baseball teams, and they probably could handle a 3rd team. the NBA has 2 teams but it's still more popular than the NHL...which has 3 teams. Personally I think 3 teams is one too many, and we all know the Rangers are a billion dollar gold mine. Either the Isles or Devils should be somewhere else. The Isles were 28th in attendance, the Devils were 26th, and surprisingly - despite selling out every game, the Rangers are 18th due to capacity issues .
    Look at the secondary market for Rangers tickets, then call the season ticket office and tell them you are interested in seats and see what they say. They can easily sell out 22,000+ a night.

    Having the Islanders or Devils move, wouldn't solve any issues for either team, attendance wise. Maybe a lot of Devils fans become Isles fans or vice versa, but very few are going to travel from NJ to games in Bklyn/queens/LI and the same from LI to NJ. If the Devils left, I would not expect more than maybe a handful of Devils fans to become Rangers fans, but in time Central and North Jersey would become Rangers territory again. So, you would have a case of one team that is in the same situation and the other with an even stronger foothold in the area. What would need to happen to have 2 strong fan bases in the area would be for the Rangers to leave. Not that it would ever happen, but then the Devils and Isles would have their suburban stronghold and they would eventually split the city fanbase. It would take a lot of time, as Rangers fans are not likely to root for either team right away, but eventually it would get there. Thinking back on it, had the city not offered the tax break on MSG and Gulf & Western (think they owned them at the time) had moved to Brendan Byrne like was feared, it is what you would probably see today. NJ and part of the city as Rangers fans, and LI and part of the city as Isles fans. The northern suburbs would likely split as well. On the west, closer tot he GW Rangers fans, on the east closer to the Throggs Neck and Whitestone as Isles fans.

    Leave a comment:


  • PatNYM
    replied
    Originally posted by jjpm74 View Post
    That can easily be remedied. When the Yankees built their new stadium, they also worked with MTA to get Metro North trains to go directly to the stadium during games. The same can be done in Flushing with LIRR for the Islanders with all the renovations already going on with Laguardia.

    At any rate, even with the team doing well this year, they were not selling out Barclays very often.
    Yes they were. The capacity for Barclays for hockey is only about 14,000 if you don't count the obstructed seats, most of which they do not sell. They were averaging over 13,000 per game.

    Leave a comment:


  • mandrake
    replied
    I took the Hudson line from Peekskill to Yankee Stadium on Sunday . Free parking on weekends, no parking M-F unless you have one of the impossible to get parking permits. Cost was $15 rd trip, which is great for one person but not so great for a carload of 4-5. After Peeksill @ 11:21 am, the next stop at Yankee Stadium was 12:04 (actually disembarked at 12:10)

    Thankfully I had tickets for a club so I feasted on porterhouse and shrimp cocktails in AIR CONDITIONING because that sun and heat were brutal. Sadly, the Giants lost. But at least I was comfy while I had breakfast lunch and dinner ...with desserts.

    I believe this was plate number 2 of 4 , or was it 5? Anyway, no more baseball sun for this guy.


    Back to trains, while the Hudson line is very smooth and the schedule is decent, the Harlem and New Haven lines are not direct. Both of those lines have you travelling to 125th Street, getting off the train, crossing the platform, and then getting a north bound Hudson line train from 125th Street to the YS station.

    Steinbrenner had argued for decades for the rail road to build a station for the Hudson line, seeing that the tracks went past the stadium since it was built in 1923.

    As for the Mets, I can't see how the LIRR could connect the other lines to go to Citi and a new arena without going to 61st street (similar, but further than , the Yankees transfer at 125th St)

    Way back for the 1939-1940 World's fair, the GG line (as it was called) ran to the site from the Forest Hills station and traveled at ground level using a route now used by the Van Wyck. Using 20/20 hindsight, this would have been ideal to keep in place. (Also for the 1939-1940 Fair, the 2nd Avenue line crossed over the Queensboro Bridge and out to Flushing Meadow. It was the only line that could serve BMT and IRT)


    Metro NY has 2 football teams and 2 baseball teams, and they probably could handle a 3rd team. the NBA has 2 teams but it's still more popular than the NHL...which has 3 teams. Personally I think 3 teams is one too many, and we all know the Rangers are a billion dollar gold mine. Either the Isles or Devils should be somewhere else. The Isles were 28th in attendance, the Devils were 26th, and surprisingly - despite selling out every game, the Rangers are 18th due to capacity issues .
    Attached Files

    Leave a comment:


  • jjpm74
    replied
    Originally posted by PatNYM View Post
    True, but the Isles fan who works in the city and lives on LI, can take the train to the game after work. Then, take the train home to any LIRR station not on the Pt Washington line. To do that at Citi would be a disaster. Have to go back to Woodside, then to Jamaica, then likely change to get your train home.
    That can easily be remedied. When the Yankees built their new stadium, they also worked with MTA to get Metro North trains to go directly to the stadium during games. The same can be done in Flushing with LIRR for the Islanders with all the renovations already going on with Laguardia.

    At any rate, even with the team doing well this year, they were not selling out Barclays very often.

    Leave a comment:


  • PatNYM
    replied
    Originally posted by jjpm74 View Post
    The NHL has a seat minimum agreed to under the last CBA that the "new" coliseum is well under. The citizens of the area voted down a tax to build a bigger coliseum because they are already taxed to death and Islanders ownership did not want to pick up the bill to build the coliseum big enough to fit league minimum standards.

    The whole thing was really stupid since most Islanders fans have no interest in going to Brooklyn to see games nor do the players. To add insult to injury, many seats at Barclays have views that are completely obstructed. Ownership responded to complaints about obstructed views by saying that the fans in those seats should just watch the game on their iPhones (talk about lousy ownership). I wouldn't be surprised if the team ends up moving out of the state.
    True, but the Isles fan who works in the city and lives on LI, can take the train to the game after work. Then, take the train home to any LIRR station not on the Pt Washington line. To do that at Citi would be a disaster. Have to go back to Woodside, then to Jamaica, then likely change to get your train home.

    The obstructed view seats are very overblown and most seats with significant obstructions are not even sold. Yes, the iphone remark was quite dumb and the guy was lambasted for that.

    Leave a comment:


  • PatNYM
    replied
    Originally posted by mandrake View Post
    We have a Willets Pt - Iron Triangle Thread somewhere buried that went on for pages and pages and was quite heated .

    The main point if I recall correctly was the incredibly costly project of cleaning up the toxic waste . The land below those chop shops are a Love Canal .
    I read on an Isles board they are tearing down the chop shops to make temporary long-term parking for Laguardia, for when Laguardia starts it's renovations.

    The arena for the Isles would be going where Shea stood if it happens at all.

    Leave a comment:


  • PatNYM
    replied
    Originally posted by Mongoose View Post
    I mean the rink at the Coliseum. It's still there, right? Why don't they just go back?
    Because they had a horrendous lease, a horrendous arena. The County is not going to give the Isles a more favorable lease in exchange for the Isles picking up the tab on renovations.

    Leave a comment:


  • runningshoes
    replied
    They should move the Islanders to Quebec City. Problem solved. To many teams in the metropolitan area now, anyways.

    Leave a comment:


  • jjpm74
    replied
    Originally posted by Mongoose View Post
    I mean the rink at the Coliseum. It's still there, right? Why don't they just go back?
    They can't because of the new CBA. They can play some games there, but they cannot play an entire season there.

    Leave a comment:


  • Mongoose
    replied
    Originally posted by jjpm74 View Post
    The NHL has a seat minimum agreed to under the last CBA that the "new" coliseum is well under. The citizens of the area voted down a tax to build a bigger coliseum because they are already taxed to death and Islanders ownership did not want to pick up the bill to build the coliseum big enough to fit league minimum standards.

    The whole thing was really stupid since most Islanders fans have no interest in going to Brooklyn to see games nor do the players. To add insult to injury, many seats at Barclays have views that are completely obstructed. Ownership responded to complaints about obstructed views by saying that the fans in those seats should just watch the game on their iPhones (talk about lousy ownership). I wouldn't be surprised if the team ends up moving out of the state.
    I mean the rink at the Coliseum. It's still there, right? Why don't they just go back?

    Leave a comment:


  • jjpm74
    replied
    Originally posted by Mongoose View Post
    Yeah, Fred's offering to "build" the arena. If that's the case let him use his own money, not public money. Better yet, focus the money and attention on the Mets.

    Why exactly was the Coliseum unsuitable for hockey? I know Islanders ownership had been trying to hustle a real estate development on the public coin and failed. Any other "reasons" the rink was no good for hockey?
    The NHL has a seat minimum agreed to under the last CBA that the "new" coliseum is well under. The citizens of the area voted down a tax to build a bigger coliseum because they are already taxed to death and Islanders ownership did not want to pick up the bill to build the coliseum big enough to fit league minimum standards.

    The whole thing was really stupid since most Islanders fans have no interest in going to Brooklyn to see games nor do the players. To add insult to injury, many seats at Barclays have views that are completely obstructed. Ownership responded to complaints about obstructed views by saying that the fans in those seats should just watch the game on their iPhones (talk about lousy ownership). I wouldn't be surprised if the team ends up moving out of the state.

    Leave a comment:

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