how many wins in 2006?

[west coast orange and black]

the giants won a dissappointing 75 after taking 91 in 2004.

the 2006 giants are good for how many wins?

[west coast orange and black]

93 for the first-place giants.

[KHenry14]

I really think that the starting staff is going to be very strong, so I'm going with 96.

KH14

[RobertHConner]

97 & at least an NLCS appearance.

[west coast orange and black]

96 and 97 wins?

i hope that i am wrong and you guys are right.

[Honus Wagner Rules]

Wow. Sadly, I must disagree. It's going to be pretty tought to increase their win total by 20. I don't think the Giants are really noticably better than last season. Bonds, Vizquel, Finley, and Alou are over 40 or approaching 40. Their catcher is 35 years old. I doubt in the history of baseball there has ever been a playoff caliber team with so many 40 year olds at key postions. And there is no gurantee that Schmidt will rebound.

I know I sound like a broken record but I am mad :grouchy at the Giant's pathetic farm system. They produce nothing in terms of position players. Is it too much ask for the Giants to produce one all-star caliber outfielder in 15 years? Everyone thinks they produce great pitching prospects but how many of those prospects actually become good pitchers? Just two years ago the Giants were hailing the Williams/Ainsworth/Foppert trio as the next great generation of Giants. So what happened? What makes Matt Cain any different from those three? When it comes to the farm system, Sabean has been a complete failure. And when I try to discuss this with other Giants fans the immediate respond with "But he's makes great trades!". Well, that not the issue becuse no mater how many "great trades" Sabien has made, that doesn't change the fact the the Giants farm system is a joke. When Fred Lewis is your best position prospect, that just scares me. I look atround in the majors ans see players like David Wright, Joe Mauer, Prince Fielder, B.J. Upton, Rickie Weeks, and Delmon Young, I ask myself how come the Giants NEVER have those kinds of prospects? h

Teams that can't or won't spend top dollar must work the farm system. Teams like the Indians and Twins make great use of their farm system producing many quality position players. Of course what can you expect from a team that passed up on drafting Mike Mussina in the first round of the 1990 draft TWICE!!!

[west coast orange and black]

wags, it will be tough for the giants to increase their win total by 20. but we can hope, right?

although several giants are inching their way towards social security i believe that this year's version will be much improved over last year's. c'mon, you gotta like the 2006 bonds model more than the 2005.

and while there is guarantee that schimdt will rebound, is there ever a guarantee how a player will do in any particular season? no one last year, for instance, evn in as late as may, could have predicted what bonds' season was gonna be.

i know that you get ticked every time that you think about the giants farm system and what it has produced. (er, not produced.) but "williams", "ainsworth" and "foppert" can not be seriously mentioned in the same sentence as "cain". big man cain's stuff is the real deal. he is an intimidator almost the way that gossage used to be.
he is downright scary.

anywaze, sabean has chosen to assemble teams using trades rather than a farm system, and the giants have paid the price for it, true. but i honestly believe that sabean has been taking the season-to-season path almost entirely because of bonds.
i think that the post-bonds era will usher in a different way of assembling giants teams.

[Honus Wagner Rules]

wags, it will be tough for the giants to increase their win total by 20. but we can hope, right?

Yes, we can hope.

although several giants are inching their way towards social security i believe that this year's version will be much improved over last year's. c'mon, you gotta like the 2006 bonds model more than the 2005.

If Bonds is 100% he's still be good but probably not at the 2001-2004 Bonds level.

and while there is guarantee that schimdt will rebound, is there ever a guarantee how a player will do in any particular season? no one last year, for instance, evn in as late as may, could have predicted what bonds' season was gonna be.

I hope Schmidt's issues were just temporary. He's not that old but he has been worked very hard.

i know that you get ticked every time that you think about the giants farm system and what it has produced. (er, not produced.) but "williams", "ainsworth" and "foppert" can not be seriously mentioned in the same sentence as "cain". big man cain's stuff is the real deal. he is an intimidator almost the way that gossage used to be. he is downright scary.

I wish I had the 2003 Baseball America Prospects book with me. I'll dig it up. All three were highly touted, especially Foppert was rated the #1 Giants prospect. Williams was #2 and Ainsworth was #3. He had nasty stuff just like Cain. Cain does have the advantage that he is younger than the other three when the came up. What really ticked me off is when the Giants just gave up on Williams at age 23. He had a really good year in 2003 as a 21 year old. I think all he needed was some adjustments and he would have been fine. But, instead, the Giants just gave up on him.

anywaze, sabean has chosen to assemble teams using trades rather than a farm system, and the giants have paid the price for it, true. but i honestly believe that sabean has been taking the season-to-season path almost entirely because of bonds.
i think that the post-bonds era will usher in a different way of assembling giants teams.

I agree but Sabean should have been preparing for Bonds retirement already. He can't wait until Bonds actually retires then start drafting hitters in the early rounds of the draft. He should have been doing that 2-3 years ago in anticipation of Bonds retirement. That way when Bonds does retire the Giants would have a new wave Giants prospects waiting in the wings.

[west coast orange and black]

it's cool that foppert was the #1 prospect, wags.
but you got your "#1 prospect" and then you got your "#1 prospect".
cain falls into the latter category.

[Honus Wagner Rules]

it's cool that foppert was the #1 prospect, wags.
but you got your "#1 prospect" and then you got your "#1 prospect".
cain falls into the latter category.

But west coast, don't you remember how everyone, and I mean everyone, was ooying and awing over Foppert in '03. He was going to be the next great Giants' pitcher, our generation's Juan Marichal. His first major league start was a big deal to Giants fans. And Cain wan't all that in 2005. His 30K in 46.3 IP is not a great indicator. If he's got nasty stuff shouldn't he have a K per inning?

[RobertHConner]

I don't think the GM is to blame for Foppert's Tommy John surgery. I still think Foppert is going to be a very good pitcher if he can stay healthy.
Funny Story: I saw him beat Maddux in Atlanta his rookie season. The kid beside my wife & I kept saying send him to the showers before every pitch to a Giants hitter. It was very distracting. He was also saying silly stuff before every single Foppert pitch. In desperation my wife told the kid's father that Jesse was my little brother. They watched in awe for the rest of the game & I had enjoyed the event with fewer distractions. I didn't think they would bite on the story, but after a beer run the kid's dad told me, 'They took your brother out while you were. He pitched great tonight-he's going to be very good.' Like any cynical big brother, I replied, 'Yeah, but he gets lazy & gives up too many solo shots.'

Williams appeared to have training issues. His weight flucuated rather dramatically. I like Jerome, but there seems to be a possibility of a Livan Hernandez problem. Livan couldn't get his conditioning under control until he was traded one too many times. It remains to be seen whether or not Williams will respond.

Every time I saw Cain pitch he was very difficult to make solid contact against. He may not have been striking out an inordinate amount of hitters, but they weren't exactly on top of him either. Aside from a shaky start last year, in which he became entirely too predictable, Noah Lowery has been wonderful. I don't think much of Hennessey & the jury is still out on Correia.

As far as Sabean doing this veteran thing on a year to year basis primarily because of Bonds, I don't think so. I've read on more than a few occasions that it is necessary to win annualy & keep the seats full because the Giants actualy pay their own mortgage on the ballpark. Until the bills are paid they can't afford to go through growing pains or rebuilding. Most clubs let the taxpayers take that burden from them, but the Giants didn't do that. Bonds' salary does, however, present further constraints. If Bonds doesn't catch Aaron this year I expect he might be back at a reduced salary in 2007. It would be kind of cool to see him get something other than booed at an All-Star game (SF has it in '07).

I'll research aging pennant winners tomorrow. I think this team can win the West w/o a problem & I believe their pitching can stand up to New York, Atlanta, St. Louis & Chicago. Houston would be a stretch, but the 'Stros don't have an overwhelming offense so far.

[Edgartohof]

Well, offensively, they are fairly fine (heck, they've got bonds - what else do you need), I also am wanting to see how Winn will pan out - let's see if he can keep up his end of season numbers!

A lot will depend on the pitching, as Bonds' numbers will not be as high as in previous years, so more pressure will be on them.

Optimistically, I'd say 89, and with everything coming together, 93 or so, but at worst, I'd still say they have a .500 team at least.

[Jake83]

What I want --- 4 Wins ( They can beat the Madres a few times)

Realistic wish 77

[west coast orange and black]

i do not recall, wags, that foppert was touted as this generation's marichal.
somehow, i missed reading/hearing it.

nonetheless, big man cain has tremendous stuff. the kind of stuff that intimidates.

i do not recall the last time that a giants rookie went out and had this kind of stretch:

date ---- inn -- h -- er -- bb - k -- era
29 aug -- 5.0 -- 3 -- 2 -- 4 -- 2 -- 3.60
???
09 sep -- 9.0 -- 2 -- 1 -- 1 -- 8 -- 1.71
14 sep -- 6.0 -- 3 -- 2 -- 6 -- 2 -- 2.00
19 sep -- 7.0 -- 4 -- 2 -- 2 -- 7 -- 2.12
24 sep -- 6.0 -- 1 -- 1 -- 3 -- 4 -- 2.02
30 sep -- 6.1 -- 6 -- 3 -- 2 -- 3 -- 2.33

as for a strikeout per, the guy enters 2006 still a rookie.
besides, how many guys did that last season?
santana, peavy and prior completes the list, i believe.