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2017-18 Giants offseason thread

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  • #16
    Giants don't have much to offer. Why do the Giants minor league farms, have prospects who are not as good as most other Team farms ?

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    • #17
      Originally posted by 1giantfan View Post
      Giants don't have much to offer. Why do the Giants minor league farms, have prospects who are not as good as most other Team farms ?
      Because it's hard to draft top talent when you draft at the back of the pack. In the 2018 draft the Giants do have the #2 overall pick. The last time the Giants had the #2 overall pick in the draft they picked this guy who was kind of decent.


      Will Clark 2.jpg
      Strikeouts are boring! Besides that, they're fascist. Throw some ground balls - it's more democratic.-Crash Davis

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      • #18
        The Giants traded for Evan Longoria. They gave up Christian Arroyo and two lower level pitching prospects! I am NOT happy with this trade! The Giants traded for a superstar name who is no longer a superstar.

        Longoria, (per 650 PA)
        2008-13: 7.4 WAR
        2014-17: 3.8 WAR

        Longoria had his worst season hitting in 2017 and he'll be 32 years old next season.
        Strikeouts are boring! Besides that, they're fascist. Throw some ground balls - it's more democratic.-Crash Davis

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        • #19
          Originally posted by Honus Wagner Rules View Post
          The Giants traded for Evan Longoria. They gave up Christian Arroyo and two lower level pitching prospects! I am NOT happy with this trade! The Giants traded for a superstar name who is no longer a superstar.

          Longoria, (per 650 PA)
          2008-13: 7.4 WAR
          2014-17: 3.8 WAR

          Longoria had his worst season hitting in 2017 and he'll be 32 years old next season.
          You forgot to add the Giants also included Span and his contract.

          Also this from Marc Topkin
          @TBTimes_Rays:

          Don't have exact figure but heard #Rays are sending #Giants in the $10M to $15M range to cover some of Longoria's deferred salary and $2M trade bonus,

          That should come close to breaking even on the dollars (2018) if the Giants accounting department do their work.

          And you add on the fact that this should stop Pablo from starting, perhaps even playing for the Giants in 2018.

          So yes we got a superstar who is not super anymore but can still field quite well, and hit decently (yes even though 2017 was a down year). But we got rid of one of the worst outfielders in the majors if not the worst and his contract. So our offense got a little better and our defense got a whole lot better. Got rid of the pipe dreams of Pablo ever being good again (he has been on a decline for years now), and opened up the outfield for a better defensive player.

          Yes I was not keen on losing Arroyo but I'm guessing the Giants didn't see him as being the Giant they thought he would be. Perhaps they saw signs of Gary Brown.

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          • #20
            Originally posted by Honus Wagner Rules View Post

            Because it's hard to draft top talent when you draft at the back of the pack. In the 2018 draft the Giants do have the #2 overall pick. The last time the Giants had the #2 overall pick in the draft they picked this guy who was kind of decent.


            Will Clark 2.jpg
            Well I do agree with that, I do wonder how the dodgers every year have great prospects. That have had winning seasons for a long time now. Last losing season was 2010 (80-82). and had winning season before that. There farm systems just produce better than ours. I know we had our share (Crawford, Bum, Posey...etc), but not lately.

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            • #21
              I would have preferred a rebuild but to be fair the Giants did not give up a ton. Yeah it was their top prospect but he is "only" a lower level top100 guy and he did not really develope that well this year. Also the rays eat Spahn's salary and a little bit of longoria's so it is not terrible regarding cash.

              sure it makes the Giants system even worse and with another trade or two it might even become the very worst system in baseball but they have to rebuild anyway down the road so it might take 4-5 years instead of 2-3 if they sell everything now. Maybe they can sneak into a wild card or two before they go 2012 Phillies (old, overpaid, no farm system). Any farm can be turned around, even the Phillies did it. They had to endure 6-7 straight losing seasons but eventuallythey got there.
              I now have my own non commercial blog about training for batspeed and power using my training experience in baseball and track and field.

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              • #22
                Originally posted by dominik View Post
                I would have preferred a rebuild but to be fair the Giants did not give up a ton. Yeah it was their top prospect but he is "only" a lower level top100 guy and he did not really develope that well this year. Also the rays eat Spahn's salary and a little bit of longoria's so it is not terrible regarding cash.

                sure it makes the Giants system even worse and with another trade or two it might even become the very worst system in baseball but they have to rebuild anyway down the road so it might take 4-5 years instead of 2-3 if they sell everything now. Maybe they can sneak into a wild card or two before they go 2012 Phillies (old, overpaid, no farm system). Any farm can be turned around, even the Phillies did it. They had to endure 6-7 straight losing seasons but eventuallythey got there.
                You mean like trade away Posey, MadBum, and Crawford? To me that's a "rebuild". If it's going to to take 4-5 years to get back to being a serious contender then Posey and Crawford will not a major contributors in 2022. Both will be 31 already next season.
                Last edited by Honus Wagner Rules; 01-07-2018, 02:43 PM.
                Strikeouts are boring! Besides that, they're fascist. Throw some ground balls - it's more democratic.-Crash Davis

                Comment


                • #23
                  Originally posted by 1giantfan View Post

                  Well I do agree with that, I do wonder how the dodgers every year have great prospects. That have had winning seasons for a long time now. Last losing season was 2010 (80-82). and had winning season before that. There farm systems just produce better than ours. I know we had our share (Crawford, Bum, Posey...etc), but not lately.
                  I looked at the top homegrown Dodgers and when they were drafted or signed as international free agents.

                  Kenley Jansen (2004)
                  Clayton Kershaw (2006)
                  Joc Pederson (2010)
                  Cory Seager (2012)
                  Yasiel Piug (2012)
                  Cody Bellinger (2013)

                  The Giants had great player development in the late 2000's which led to the three World Series titles. But lets be honest. There was some luck involved. In the 2008 draft Buster Posey was widely considered the #1 prospect but he fell to the #5 pick. The Rays had the #1 pick in 2008 and passed on Posey. This one "mistake" cost the Rays dearly. Posey reached the majors for good in 2010 and the Rays were in the playoffs in 2010, 2011, and 2013. The Rays won 90 games in 2012 and missed the playoffs by just 3 games. Posey had a monster season in 2012 and likely would have pushed the Rays to the postseason in 2012. Put Posey on the Rays in 2010-2013 and it's possible the Rays return to the World Series and win it all.
                  Strikeouts are boring! Besides that, they're fascist. Throw some ground balls - it's more democratic.-Crash Davis

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                  • #24
                    No way do I want to rebuild. The talent by and large is still there, especially in the IF and SP. Obviously there are OF issues, IMO Pence is in full decline. And I'm not counting on any of our young OF talent (Shaw, Duggar, Ramos) to make any impact in 2018. So to compete Evans needs to make some type of move. He'll do something for sure, but what he'll do is certainly a mystery.
                    “Well, I like to say I’m completely focused, right? I mean, the game’s on the line. It’s not like I’m thinking about what does barbecue Pop Chips and Cholula taste like. Because I already know that answer — it tastes friggin’ awesome!"--Brian Wilson

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                    • #25
                      Well, team is ready to go. Bum hit a 445 ft dinger yesterday!
                      “Well, I like to say I’m completely focused, right? I mean, the game’s on the line. It’s not like I’m thinking about what does barbecue Pop Chips and Cholula taste like. Because I already know that answer — it tastes friggin’ awesome!"--Brian Wilson

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                      • #26
                        Spoke too soon, MadBum took a batted ball off his pitching hand and broke it. AAAARRRRRRRGGGGGGHHHHHH!!!!!
                        “Well, I like to say I’m completely focused, right? I mean, the game’s on the line. It’s not like I’m thinking about what does barbecue Pop Chips and Cholula taste like. Because I already know that answer — it tastes friggin’ awesome!"--Brian Wilson

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                        • #27
                          so is this where everyone is migrating to after the message boards were eliminated?

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                          • #28
                            The season hasn't even started and the team is already in the hole?! Ugh!
                            Strikeouts are boring! Besides that, they're fascist. Throw some ground balls - it's more democratic.-Crash Davis

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