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  • Lincecum hurt, Bumgarner to start

    Bumgarner to start; Lincecum hurt


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    Bumgarner throws for the San Jose Giants in April

    September 8, 2009

    MORE GIANTS NEWS AND VIDEO

    SAN FRANCISCO, CA - The Giants are calling up their top pitching prospect, Madison Bumgarner to pitch tonight against the Padres.

    Tim Lincecum is reported to be injured and will miss his start tonight.

    Baseball writer John Shea of the San Francisco Chronicle first reported the move to call up Bumgarner this afternoon.

    Bumgarner, just two years removed from high school, was the 10th overall pick in the 2007 draft and was dominant at Double-A Connecticut, posting a 9-1 record with a 1.93 ERA and 69 K's.

    Tune in to Chronicle Live at 5pm for all the latest on these breaking stories as they develop on Comcast SportsNet Bay Area.
    1. The more I learn, the more convinced I am that many players are over-rated due to inflated stats from offensive home parks (and eras)
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  • #2
    Originally posted by 9RoyHobbsRF View Post
    Bumgarner to start; Lincecum hurt


    Tim Lincecum is reported to be injured and will miss his start tonight.
    Seems Timmy's back flared up and doctors reccomended 24-36 hours rest minimum. Bochy says Tim will pitch the first game he becomes available.

    Comment


    • #3
      So they won't play Buster Posey but they'll start Madison Bumgarner? Brilliant.
      Strikeouts are boring! Besides that, they're fascist. Throw some ground balls - it's more democratic.-Crash Davis

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by Honus Wagner Rules View Post
        So they won't play Buster Posey but they'll start Madison Bumgarner? Brilliant.
        The ninth inning yesterday would have been an ideal time to get Buster's feet wet.
        San Francisco Giants, World Series Champions in 2010, 2012, and 2014!!!

        "Not everything that counts can be counted, and not everything that can be counted counts" ~ Albert Einstein

        "Royals wear crowns, but Champions Kiss the Ring" ~ Jeremy Affeldt

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Rich the Giants fan View Post
          The ninth inning yesterday would have been an ideal time to get Buster's feet wet.
          Exactly. They should give Posey one of Eli Whiteside's starts.
          Strikeouts are boring! Besides that, they're fascist. Throw some ground balls - it's more democratic.-Crash Davis

          Comment


          • #6
            The Padres offense could be a confidence builder for Madison!
            "There's no crying in Baseball!"
            -...unless your son throws a no-no for the Giants!

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by hallzee View Post
              The Padres offense could be a confidence builder for Madison!
              Until Adrian Gonzalez deposits one into McCovey Cove!
              Strikeouts are boring! Besides that, they're fascist. Throw some ground balls - it's more democratic.-Crash Davis

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Honus Wagner Rules View Post
                Until Adrian Gonzalez deposits one into McCovey Cove!
                I'd prefer to hope for the freshman follies where an unknown pitcher gets by simply because nobody knows him.



                We'll see.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Not bad, survived the two long balls. His curveball was ok, but not very crisp.
                  San Francisco Giants, World Series Champions in 2010, 2012, and 2014!!!

                  "Not everything that counts can be counted, and not everything that can be counted counts" ~ Albert Einstein

                  "Royals wear crowns, but Champions Kiss the Ring" ~ Jeremy Affeldt

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Rich the Giants fan View Post
                    Not bad, survived the two long balls. His curveball was ok, but not very crisp.
                    Needs some seasoning for sure. He does seem to have one really important thing going for him though, his mental approach, or mental toughness if you like.

                    Maybe his ball wasn't moving like it normally does cuz he was a wee bit tense?

                    Pretty big kid, and he's 20 y.o.? Yow!

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by CandlestickBum View Post
                      Needs some seasoning for sure. He does seem to have one really important thing going for him though, his mental approach, or mental toughness if you like.

                      Maybe his ball wasn't moving like it normally does cuz he was a wee bit tense?

                      Pretty big kid, and he's 20 y.o.? Yow!
                      His velocity was down and apparently has been for a little bit. High 80's and low 90's isn't what I expected, though he didn't duck the question about it afterwards. He could just be going through a dead arm period but without a premium second pitch, I worry about that lost velocity. Just a little though, as I expect it to come back.
                      San Francisco Giants, World Series Champions in 2010, 2012, and 2014!!!

                      "Not everything that counts can be counted, and not everything that can be counted counts" ~ Albert Einstein

                      "Royals wear crowns, but Champions Kiss the Ring" ~ Jeremy Affeldt

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Rich the Giants fan View Post
                        His velocity was down and apparently has been for a little bit. High 80's and low 90's isn't what I expected, though he didn't duck the question about it afterwards. He could just be going through a dead arm period but without a premium second pitch, I worry about that lost velocity. Just a little though, as I expect it to come back.
                        From what I read Giants management made a concerted effort to get Bumgarner to not try to strikeout every one out and to "pitch to contact".

                        This is from a Ray Ratto column in today's S.F. Chronicle.

                        What the folks got was a steady stream of fastballs between 88 and 90 mph - 51 out of his 76 pitches, the rest sliders, cutters and a rare changeup. The Internetsia suggested this was a sign of arm-weariness, as he consistently hit 93-94 in the minors, but Sabean said it was in fact more a matter of San Jose pitching coach Ross Grimsley trying to force a more economical approach on Bumgarner. "He was getting a little fastball-happy," Sabean said, talking about his reduced velocity, "and we just wanted him to stop trying to strike everyone out."

                        http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/articl...SPTB19KBRD.DTL
                        MadBum's strikeout rate decreased dramatically in '09 from his '08 levels. I wonder if the Giants effort to get MadBum to change his approach is a response to what happened to Matt Cain? In the minors Cain was a strikeout machine. Cain had 447 K's in 397.2 innings (10.1 k/9). Cain debuted in the majors at age 20 as well. Yet early in Cain's career he was often criticized for not know "how to pitch".
                        Strikeouts are boring! Besides that, they're fascist. Throw some ground balls - it's more democratic.-Crash Davis

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Honus Wagner Rules View Post
                          MadBum's strikeout rate decreased dramatically in '09 from his '08 levels. I wonder if the Giants effort to get MadBum to change his approach is a response to what happened to Matt Cain? In the minors Cain was a strikeout machine. Cain had 447 K's in 397.2 innings (10.1 k/9). Cain debuted in the majors at age 20 as well. Yet early in Cain's career he was often criticized for not know "how to pitch".
                          They were both also pitching against minor leaguers, which I don't have to tell you don't measure up to big league hitters! MadBum (can we please stop calling him that?) pitched low A ball all year last year and moved up and up and up this year, pitching against more talented hitters. Same thing can be said for Cain.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            As most of you already know, Madison Bumgarner made his big league debut Tuesday night, pitching into the sixth inning with no decision in the Giants’ 4-3 loss to the Padres. That’s big news, for several reasons.

                            First, let’s appreciate that Bumgarner has been the best pitcher in the minor leagues the last two seasons—and it’s really not close. The lefthander is 27-5, 1.65 over 273 innings in 2008-2009, with 107 innings coming this year at Double-A Connecticut. Bumgarner has a sterling 256-to-55 strikeout-to-walk ratio overall and gave up just nine home runs in the minors, though he allowed a pair in his debut last night.

                            While Bumgarner maintained a sterling strikeout rate in the high Class A California League earlier this season, his rate dipped to just 5.8 per nine innings in the Eastern League. The main culprit for that decrease has been the decreased fastball velocity that was on display last night in the big leagues. He threw 76 pitches, according to MLB’s Pitch F/X data, and 48 were fastballs, most of which checked in around 88 mph.

                            That’s consistent with what Eastern League managers and scouts are saying about Bumgarner. One scout, who also saw Bumgarner as an amateur at South Caldwell High in Hudson, N.C., said Bumgarner didn’t quite have the arm and hand speed now that he saw back in 2007, when the Giants took the lefthander the 10th overall selection. He also didn’t think the decrease in velocity was anything to worry about, not yet anyway.

                            "He threw a lot of 87s and 88s when I saw him and touched some 90s, but he still really pitched off the fastball," the scout said. "It was almost more encouraging to see him pitch that well using pitchability rather than just getting by on pure, raw stuff.

                            "I wouldn’t say he’s got a dead arm period, but I think it’s just the natural period that all young pitchers go through in their first or second year, when they lose a little arm speed (and) have to pitch through some fatigue."

                            This scout attributed Bumgarner’s success to his ability to create difficult angles for the hitter, command the fastball and maintain the pitch’s excellent late life. He said he’d still grade out Bumgarner’s fastball as above-average, even with velocity that was just average.

                            "He uses the fastball so well, and he’s got some deception," the scout said. "He throws a little across his body but not terribly, and he’s got that life and command. The thing is, so many young pitchers get exposed at upper levels because they don’t know how to pitch off the fastball. And when hitters don’t chase their secondary stuff when it’s out of the zone, they often don’t know how to pitch off the fastball. Or you’ll see that their fastball is really true and doesn’t have good enough life, or they don’t command it.

                            "He does those things already. He knows how to pitch off the fastball. We’ve seen him pitch at 93-94 miles per hour when he’s at his best, and I’ve seen him have a plus breaking ball when he stays on top of it, though it was inconsistent when he was an amateur. I didn’t see a great breaking ball when I saw him this year. But he still pitched very well because of the quality of that fastball, and I think we’ll see that electricity come back."

                            Bumgarner may turn out to be a major test of just how successful a starting pitcher can be working off one plus pitch, provided that pitch is the fastball. He’ll have to maintain the premium life and command the pitch exhibits while getting back to his old velocity to be a front-line starter. No matter how he develops, he’s unlikely to match the dominant numbers he posted as a minor leaguer.


                            http://www.baseballamerica.com/blog/prospects/?p=6374

                            Carl Steward, subbing for Andrew Baggarly again.

                            For a guy who flew cross-country Monday and then was told he’d be replacing Tim Lincecum as Tuesday night’s starter in the heat of a playoff race, Madison Bumgarner acquitted himself quite well against the Padres. Two runs, albeit laser-beam homers by Chase Headley and Kevin Kouzmanoff, in 5 an a third innings was as much as the Giants really could have asked, although you have to wonder if he had a second crack at it, Bruce Bochy would have pulled the kid after just 76 pitches.


                            Maybe Bochy was getting radar-gun reports that Bumgarner was throwing mostly in the high 80s throughout his stint with a top-out of 91 mph and figured disaster might be imminent if he left him in much longer. During spring training, Bumgarner was throwing in the mid-90s, but the velocity wasn’t really there during his major-league debut. He moved the ball in and out and made some nice pitches, but he didn’t blow a single hitter away with a swinging strike. That isn’t what you expect from a 20-year-old phenom from Hickory, N.C.

                            Asked about his velocity dip after the game, Bumgarner didn’t duck it. He said it’s been an issue in some of his most recent starts at Double-A Connecticut as well. But he isn’t sure of the cause.

                            “I don’t know,” he said. “It feels the same coming out, it’s just not reading on the radar gun. I guess I may be getting a little tired. I don’t feel it, but I guess that’s what’s happening. Hard to say.”

                            Over 25 starts, Bumgarner had pitched a combined 131 and a third innings at Class A and AA before making his Giants debut, so it’s not like he’s been terribly overworked. Then again, he did just turn 20 a little more than a month ago. Perhaps he’s just going through a “dead arm” period.

                            But on a team where we’re used to seeing Matt Cain, Jonathan Sanchez and Lincecum hit mid-90s regularly, Bumgarner’s lack of “stuff” was pretty mystifying. It belies a guy who has a 27-5 record and 1.65 ERA over his first two seasons in the minors.


                            http://blogs.mercurynews.com/extraba...ot-on-the-gun/
                            San Francisco Giants, World Series Champions in 2010, 2012, and 2014!!!

                            "Not everything that counts can be counted, and not everything that can be counted counts" ~ Albert Einstein

                            "Royals wear crowns, but Champions Kiss the Ring" ~ Jeremy Affeldt

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Keep in mind that he was pitching against a poor offensive club who had no idea what he was like.

                              Advantage pitcher. Given a third, fourth and pr fifth time through the lineup, Bumgarner might not fare so well without a tad bit more.
                              San Francisco Giants, World Series Champions in 2010, 2012, and 2014!!!

                              "Not everything that counts can be counted, and not everything that can be counted counts" ~ Albert Einstein

                              "Royals wear crowns, but Champions Kiss the Ring" ~ Jeremy Affeldt

                              Comment

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