Van Slyke trade in 1987

[Brownieand45sfan]

I know the popular wisdom is that the trade of andy Van Slyke to Pittsburgh helped us win a pennant in 1987 by giving the Cardinals solidity "up the middle" with Tony Pena.

But looking back at it on paper it looks pretty bad:
Tony never wins another defensive honor with the Cardinals, he hits only .214 (25 points less than Mike Lavalliere did in 86)
Van Slyke goes on to be an offensive and defensive All-Star, as promised
Lavalliere hits .300
Mike Dunne wins the league in W-L% even after being promoted to the Pirates in June

thoughts? on the whole, good trade or bad?

[StanTheMan]

Pena played some good D, don't forget that. But it was a bad trade.

[Phantom Dreamer]

Van Slyke said some things upon leaving the Mariners.

[Brownieand45sfan]

Van Slyke said some things upon leaving the Mariners.

Like what?

[Herr28]

Like what?

The only thing I saw was a few articles on van Slyke talking trash about Robinson Cano.

[Bothrops Atrox]

A man never short of opinions.

[Phantom Dreamer]

The only thing I saw was a few articles on van Slyke talking trash about Robinson Cano.

There was some jealousy regarding Edgar Martinez, bitterness about Howard Johnson being fired earlier.

[Benson]

You can make these threads for every team about player x that was traded and blossomed somewhere else. Regarding Van Slyke, I really believe he benefitted from the change of scenery. He played 4 years in St. Louis and never blossomed into a star, IIRC had quite a bit of pressure as he was highly touted.

[Phantom Dreamer]

He also said Kershaw demanded the Dodgers trade Puig, which of course would have benefitted his boy.

[PVNICK]

There was some jealousy regarding Edgar Martinez, bitterness about Howard Johnson being fired earlier.

I don't recall any of that, just the Cano comments. What was it?

[Phantom Dreamer]

Here's the Seattle Times' account of Van Slyke's comments.

http://www.seattletimes.com/sports/mariners/former-mariners-coach-andy-van-slyke-has-some-critical-things-to-say-about-robinson-cano-edgar-martinez/

[Herr28]

Here's the Seattle Times' account of Van Slyke's comments.
http://www.seattletimes.com/sports/m...dgar-martinez/

Thanks for posting that.

Some of these guys just have no business opening their mouths.

[Whoman69]

You can make these threads for every team about player x that was traded and blossomed somewhere else. Regarding Van Slyke, I really believe he benefitted from the change of scenery. He played 4 years in St. Louis and never blossomed into a star, IIRC had quite a bit of pressure as he was highly touted.

Yup, these things are easy to judge in hindsight. Pena was probably the best catcher in the league. Van Slyke was improving with the Cardinals as he had a .795 OPS in 1986, but you have to give something up to get something. You also have to factor in that Van Slyke was only a three time all-star because he had trouble staying on the field.

[Herr28]

Yup, these things are easy to judge in hindsight. Pena was probably the best catcher in the league. Van Slyke was improving with the Cardinals as he had a .795 OPS in 1986, but you have to give something up to get something. You also have to factor in that Van Slyke was only a three time all-star because he had trouble staying on the field.

Right, Pena was hitting like .290-.300 almost every year for the lowly Pirates, and was a very fine catcher. I think he could also steal some bags too, but i would have to double check that.

[Toledo Inquisition]

Right, Pena was hitting like .290-.300 almost every year for the lowly Pirates, and was a very fine catcher. I think he could also steal some bags too, but i would have to double check that.

Watching Pena catch was just painful. Not that he was bad, but it looked so uncomfortable.