No wonder GIL can't get in

[webmaster]

I owe each of you here an apology. I deleted this entire thread. If I could give an excuse it would be that I was tired and a bit upset. I had to give up my Sunday away from my family due to problems at work. Yesterday I worked 16 hours at work. Today I had a short day, only 14 hours. I got home and there were a LOT of Private Messages. Most were about members who were a bit off topic. One of them pointed to this thread and I deleted not the post, but the entire thread. I did not even realize I did it until I got up to fix my daughter her nightly warm chocolate milk and heard the email sound, sat back down, saw the PM that asked about the thread then realized I screwed up.

I am sorry. :o

Now, if possible, can somebody tell me why Gil can't get in?

[bigbum]

Gil Hodges/HOF

If we want to get Big Gil into the HOF,maybe we should do it one step at a time.
What if we true "Dodger" fans contacted the living players that he not only played with, but also the ones he played against, to assist us. Also, what
about first getting his number retired with you know who.

If you are really Dodger fans, and you saw him play you KNOW that he was
a great defensive first baseman, probably the best of his era, and he wasn't too shabby at the plate either.

I am sure that you all remember that he was a part of one of the greatest
infields ever that already has three HOF'ers. Unfortunately, No. 3, ,the Greatest defensive 3rd baseman I've ever seen can,t make, but that's another story.

What are your thoughts about this?

[DODGER DEB]

If we want to get Big Gil into the HOF,maybe we should do it one step at a time.
What if we true "Dodger" fans contacted the living players that he not only played with, but also the ones he played against, to assist us. Also, what
about first getting his number retired with you know who.

If you are really Dodger fans, and you saw him play you KNOW that he was
a great defensive first baseman, probably the best of his era, and he wasn't too shabby at the plate either.

I am sure that you all remember that he was a part of one of the greatest
infields ever that already has three HOF'ers. Unfortunately, No. 3, ,the Greatest defensive 3rd baseman I've ever seen can,t make, but that's another story.

What are your thoughts about this?

First, bigbum, welcome to OUR Forum. Always nice to add new loyal Brooklyn Dodger Fans to OUR group.

As for GIL getting into the HOF, if you go back and read some of the threads over the past few years, you will see that all the topics you raise have been covered, and then some.

That "west coast group" will NOT retire Gil's number #14, until he is voted into the HOF. It's a policy they have, and have had for years. The only exception they made to this policy was Jim Gilliam's #19.

All the members of the old Veterans Committee were contacted, over and over again in years past, on Gil's behalf....to no avail. There was a huge stumpling block on the Committee at that time, and his name was Ted Williams, who, for personal reasons, did not want to see Gil elected. So, it never happened. With this new group, it's just a matter of educating those who never saw Gil play, or manage for that matter. Hopefully they will see the light before too much time passes.

c.

[LouGehrig]

What was the story with Williams and Hodges? Was it related to Williams and Hodges managing Washington?

[kramer_47]

Ted Williams was just a real SOB, he wasn't well liked when he played and when he was older he was still an Sob with a big ego. Not many people disliked Gil Hodges but Ted Williams had alot of pull on that politically oriented oldtimers committee just look at the election of Bobby Doerr, Red Schoendienst, and Bill Mazeroski. It is ashame that they let this comittee go on for so long, the new committee has alot of egos on it but maybe they will finally vote in Gil in 2007.

[iPod]

What was the story with Williams and Hodges? Was it related to Williams and Hodges managing Washington?

I don't think it was anything other than Williams was a prominent member of the VC and was really opposed to Gil Hodges getting in.

[donzblock]

Did Gil and Ted start to hate each other after doing that full page cigarette ad where they are pictured in living color standing back to back?

[strummer]

The story I have been told for years, and which sounds true, is that unfortunately we should blame Hodges popularity and the in-your-face attitude of the Washington Senators fans. Those fans loved Hodges when he managed the Senators and regretted him leaving for the Mets. Williams became the new manager of the Senators, and, either from the very beginning or shortly thereafter, as he was not having too much success with the team, the fans not only got on Ted's back, but really pushed his button by loudly proclaiming day after day "Bring Back Hodges"!

[DODGER DEB]

The story I have been told for years, and which sounds true, is that unfortunately we should blame Hodges popularity and the in-your-face attitude of the Washington Senators fans. Those fans loved Hodges when he managed the Senators and regretted him leaving for the Mets. Williams became the new manager of the Senators, and, either from the very beginning or shortly thereafter, as he was not having too much success with the team, the fans not only got on Ted's back, but really pushed his button by loudly proclaiming day after day "Bring Back Hodges"!

You have pretty much "hit the nail right on the head", strummer.

c.

[Aa3rt]

The story I have been told for years, and which sounds true, is that unfortunately we should blame Hodges popularity and the in-your-face attitude of the Washington Senators fans. Those fans loved Hodges when he managed the Senators and regretted him leaving for the Mets. Williams became the new manager of the Senators, and, either from the very beginning or shortly thereafter, as he was not having too much success with the team, the fans not only got on Ted's back, but really pushed his button by loudly proclaiming day after day "Bring Back Hodges"!

Folks, I've heard this point made before. I'm afraid I was a little too young to have picked up on the behind the scenes goings on of the Washington Senators managerial scene-however, everyone seems to forget that Gil left after the 1967 season, with the Senators finishing at 76 & 85, 6th place in the (then) 10 team league. In 1968, Jim Lemon was the Senators manager and the team responded by going 65 & 96 and dropping to a 10th place finish. Ted Williams took over in 1969 and led the expansion Senators to their only over .500 finish, 86 & 76, 4th place in the new 6 team Eastern Division.

Expansion Senators Managers & records:

http://baseball-almanac.com/mgrtmtr2.shtml

[kramer_47]

KGCHOST I'd like you to name all first baseman better then Gil, Gil was the best First baseman of the 1950's hands down. I don't know who your favorite team or player was or how old you are but i saw Gil and the Dodgers play and I know one thing he is the best player of that era not in the HOF.

[55 chmps]

A real problem with Hodges candidacy is that there are so many 1B's better than him who aren't in the HoF. And that forces his proponents to try and trick people by saying he should get extra credit because he managed some teams and had one WS winner. As a manager his teams won at a .467 clip. You take out the miracle year and his record is real ugly.

As a Brooklyn born boy I am very fond of Gil Hodges, but he isn't an HoFer any way you slice the pie.

KCGHOST, let me ask you a question. I don't know who your favorite team is now, but say your first baseman has hit the most homeruns by a right handed hitter in NL history at the time of his retirment. Would you think he should be in the Hall of Fame? That's what Hodges did. And he had an amazing glove. Bill Mazeroski made it to the HOF because he was great definsivley, so did Ozzie Smith, and they sucked at batting. Hodges in my opinion was the complete package. Some people say that Hodges choked in pressure situations, thats why he can't get in the HOF. I don't buy it. I never saw him play or coach, but i've heard stories from my dad when he was manager with the mets and he should be in the hall even if his managerial record wasn't to hot. But some players got in the HOF with crappy managerial records but were still good ballplayers. Gil was loved by everyone he played for, even if his team didn't have the best record. Maybe I haven't persuaded anyone on this topic, but i just wanted to get my point across. I expect to see Gil's plaque in the Hall of Fame very soon. This is what the commitee should keep in mind.

[tonypug]

KCGHOST, let me ask you a question. I don't know who your favorite team is now, but say your first baseman has hit the most homeruns by a right handed hitter in NL history at the time of his retirment. Would you think he should be in the Hall of Fame? That's what Hodges did. And he had an amazing glove. Bill Mazeroski made it to the HOF because he was great definsivley, so did Ozzie Smith, and they sucked at batting. Hodges in my opinion was the complete package. Some people say that Hodges choked in pressure situations, thats why he can't get in the HOF. I don't buy it. I never saw him play or coach, but i've heard stories from my dad when he was manager with the mets and he should be in the hall even if his managerial record wasn't to hot. But some players got in the HOF with crappy managerial records but were still good ballplayers. Gil was loved by everyone he played for, even if his team didn't have the best record. Maybe I haven't persuaded anyone on this topic, but i just wanted to get my point across. I expect to see Gil's plaque in the Hall of Fame very soon. This is what the commitee should keep in mind.

Just to expand on 55chmps very astute observations. Hodges also was the National League leader in grand slam home runs at the time he retired. People point to his o for 21 in the 52 World Series,but don't mention that the next year, 1953 he hit 364 in the World Series. His overall series batting average is 264, not bad considering that 0 for 21 is included. In the 1955 series 7th game he had the only 2 RBI's, otherwise we might not have had that 55 championship, and been talking about Podres and Amoros. If more people did their homework like 55chmps, Gil would already be in the Hall of Fame.

[kramer_47]

No wonder GIL can't get in

Very good points guys, he was the best 1st baseman, best righthanded hitter in the major leagues from 1950-59. He had 310 home runs and 1001 rbi in the 50's, that's an average of 31 homers and 100 rbi a year. Tony he was the grand slam leader until 1972, all those other great hitters in the 50's and 60's and it took Hank Aaron til then to tie Gil. You are right Tony the grand slams show he was clutch, he was only in a slump during the 52 WS and early in 1953 then he was back to his old self. What about the 4 homers in a game in 1950 and Gil hitting for the cycle in 1949. You know there are only 2 other players since 1900 other Gil to accomplish these 2 feats, both are in the Hall of Fame, Lou Gehrig and Chuck Klein. Good job 55 Chmps and Tonypug.

[runningshoes]

What are the comparisons, if any, between Johnny Mize and and Gil Hodges. Mize played 1884 games in a 15 year Career and Hodges played 2071 games in an 18 year career. They both finished with approximately the same amount of hits. I think Mize had 100 or so more, and they are separated by less than 100 RBI's.

The glaring difference to me is Mize's .312 average opposed to Hodges' .273

Did the writers missed the boat with Mize and does Hodges' defensive value make up the difference?