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  • Origin of the "NY" logo

    I recently did a final tour of Yankee and Shea Stadium to take as many pics as possible. At Yankee Stadium, I saw a plaque that explained the origins of the interlocking "NY" logo for the Yanks.

    I know the Mets' "NY" comes from the Giants but does anyone know where the Giants got it from?
    Sign Cespedes & Murphy

  • #2
    This is a good question. The Yankees logo was designed by Tiffany's for an 1870s memorial to a slain policeman, if I'm not mistaken. If the Yankees adopted the old NY logo designed by Tiffany's you'd have to assume the Giant's NY came later, but I believe both appeared on their respective uniforms around 1908. I'm not sure which was actually first.

    Did the Yankees nick the old Tiffany's logo first? One of their owners was a former Police Commissioner linked to Tammany Hall. One would assume he or one of his associates remembered the old Police Memorial/Tiffany's logo and that the Yankees adopted it first, and the Giants followed suit.

    Did the Giants then hire a graphic artist to pen a competing logo? I actually always thought the old Giants logo was more elegant than the Yankees logo or the later Giants/Mets logo.

    I've alway wondered about this but have never seen a reference that explained it. Does anybody know?


    "The Fightin' Met With Two Heads" - Mike Tyson/Ray Knight!

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    • #3
      Yankee NY is from Tiffanys

      When I went to YS, there was a plaque near the entrance to Memorial park that outlined the origin of the logo and it mentions the Tiffany connection. That's what made me wonder about the Giants' NY.

      I've scoured the internet looking for an answer and have not come up with anything. I'm also 28 and from Brooklyn so it's unlikely that I'll run into any NY Giants fans in person who may know the answer. I'm an avid WFAN listener and I know Chris Russo is a fan as well as newbie Evan Roberts (whose grandfather was a Giants fan thought Evan is a Mets fan).

      I tried to get through to them but I just stay on hold that long.
      Sign Cespedes & Murphy

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      • #4
        I do see the differences but it thought that was an earlier rendition of the logo and that it eventually made the transition to the one the Mets use today. I have a Cooperstown classic NY Giants hat and it's identical to the Mets logo. Here's a link to their website:

        http://www.dugout-memories.com/newgia.html
        Sign Cespedes & Murphy

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        • #5
          A "Y" superimposed on an "N" is not very complicated, so to speak, so I'm sure people have been doing it forever, long before baseball in New York. Probably multiple origins. That is just the way I tend to look at it.

          :twocents:

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          • #6
            Originally posted by Bklyn'55 View Post
            I do see the differences but it thought that was an earlier rendition of the logo and that it eventually made the transition to the one the Mets use today. I have a Cooperstown classic NY Giants hat and it's identical to the Mets logo. Here's a link to their website:

            http://www.dugout-memories.com/newgia.html
            Wow, I never realized how similar some of those old Giants cap were to Mets caps. If someone was walking the streets of NY with a 1942 Giants cap I'd be willing to bet every single person that came across it would think it was a Mets alternate cap of some sort.

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            • #7
              Looks like I need to get a new Giants hat. Mine is basically a black Mets hat sans the white and blue shading.
              Sign Cespedes & Murphy

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              • #8
                Originally posted by Toy Boat View Post
                Wow, I never realized how similar some of those old Giants cap were to Mets caps. If someone was walking the streets of NY with a 1942 Giants cap I'd be willing to bet every single person that came across it would think it was a Mets alternate cap of some sort.
                The 1942 NY Giants cap logo looks nothing like any of the Mets caps past or present. First off the Giants colors in 1942 were Royal Blue, Red and White. The cap that year was Royal blue with a Red Button and a White NY patch outlined in Red and sewn onto the cap, It was not embroidered. The lettering style (then known as serif) was pretty much what you see as my ID logo in the upper left of this posting but in two colors for 1942. The basic NY shown above was the standard Giants NY from very early in the 20th Century thru, I believe 1948. In '49 the caps as well as the uniform trim went to Orange and Black and the cap logo subtlely changed to what would later be adopted by the Mets in 1962. If you look closely at a New York Giants cap of the 50s it bears only a slight resemblance to the Mets current caps. In my mind the current Mets cap logo looks like fish hooks gone wild.

                Go to the following link to see a genuine 1950s Sal Maglie cap which was being auctioned off.
                http://www.huntauctions.com/online/i...m=717&lot_qual

                Go to this link to see a genuine 1962 Rogers Hornsby NY Mets cap
                http://www.huntauctions.com/online/i...=713&lot_qual=

                Go to this link to see a "reasonable replica" of the NY Giants cap of 1942
                http://cgi.ebay.com/NEW-YORK-NY-GIAN...3286.m20.l1116
                Last edited by [email protected]; 11-13-2008, 04:27 PM.
                RCL

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by [email protected] View Post
                  The 1942 NY Giants cap logo looks nothing like any of the Mets caps past or present. First off the Giants colors in 1942 were Royal Blue, Red and White. The cap that year was Royal blue with a Red Button and a White NY patch outlined in Red and sewn onto the cap, It was not embroidered. The lettering style (then known as serif) was pretty much what you see as my ID logo in the upper left of this posting but in two colors for 1942. The basic NY shown above was the standard Giants NY from very early in the 20th Century thru, I believe 1948. In '49 the caps as well as the uniform trim went to Orange and Black and the cap logo subtlely changed to what would later be adopted by the Mets in 1962. If you look closely at a New York Giants cap of the 50s it bears only a slight resemblance to the Mets current caps. In my mind the current Mets cap logo looks like fish hooks gone wild.

                  Go to the following link to see a genuine 1950s Sal Maglie cap which was being auctioned off.
                  http://www.huntauctions.com/online/i...m=717&lot_qual

                  Go to this link to see a genuine 1962 Rogers Hornsby NY Mets cap
                  http://www.huntauctions.com/online/i...=713&lot_qual=

                  Go to this link to see a "reasonable replica" of the NY Giants cap of 1942
                  http://cgi.ebay.com/NEW-YORK-NY-GIAN...3286.m20.l1116
                  I obviously don't know the caps as well as you do, but they sure look similar to me:



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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Toy Boat View Post
                    I obviously don't know the caps as well as you do, but they sure look similar to me:



                    Yes they do! The fact is however that this 1942 Giants knockoff by American Needle is just that.....A knockoff. They did the same thing with what they describe as the Giants 1936 model. What they did was simply take a mid 80s Mets cap and adopt the Giants colors of the era they were looking to replicate. I didn't mean to sound condensending in my previous post, I just hate to see people get taken in by "nostalgia" companies who do very little research in providing the baseball fan with authentic looking replicas. For some reason this is most prevalent in New York Giants merchandise.

                    As Ralph Zig Tyko pointed out in a couple of previous posts, your best source for truly authentic "replicas" is the Cooperstown Ball Cap company. They may be a bit expensive but they use the same materials ie. Wool felt, Leather Sweatbands, well researched and closely Authentic Logos (be they Felt sewn ons or embroidered) that were used in the era they are depicting. If you're just looking to have an old logo on a new cap, New Era is your best bet. Logo's are well researched and although everything is embroidered it is of excellent quality and made by the people who produce todays MLB caps.
                    Last edited by [email protected]; 11-14-2008, 06:38 AM.
                    RCL

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                    • #11
                      Thanks for chiming in guys, the info about the Giants vs. Mets logo is as interesting as the search for the origin, IMO. rcl, it looks like the Sal Maglie hat looks more like the Mets logo than the one on rcl and Ralph's avatar.

                      Regarding the "fish hooks" (nice comparison btw), it seems the early Giants logo had that comma looking feature on one side and a triangular point on the other but the Maglie hat has that Met-like proportional hook. Here's a decent but not sure how accurate website showing the logos throughout the years:

                      http://www.sportslogos.net/team.php?id=86

                      It also seems the Mets logo is slimmer and the "N" is not as wide allowing for the "Y" to be more towards the center and not to the left as the early Giants logo seems to be.

                      Does the progression features on the website seem accurate to anyone?
                      Last edited by Bklyn'55; 11-14-2008, 12:41 PM.
                      Sign Cespedes & Murphy

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                      • #12
                        If you look at a photo of Willie Mays, Leo Durocher, Monte Irvin or of any of the Giants taken in 1950 or 1951 you will find that the "hooks" on the top and bottom of the N were less pronounced than those of the mid 50s. It was around 1953 that the "hooks" morphed into what would become the Mets initial cap logo. Sometime in the last 10/12 years those "hooks" as well as those on the bottom of the Y on the Mets caps suddenly seem to almost form a semi circle. It's most obvious on there multi colored logos. For my money, the original logo (as shown above) is still the best looking of any New York logos including that of the Yankees.

                        Just as an aside, you may be interested to know that at one time (pre 1960s) it was extremely difficult for members of the public to obtain genuine Major League caps. In New York City for instance, there was only one store that carried them. That store was owned by a former professional hockey player who also supplied equipment to the NHL. His shop was located one story up in a NY Brownstone on 48th Street just West of Fifth Ave. It was there that I purchased my first Giants cap in 1954. His name was Gerry Cosby and the business he started continues to thrive. He first relocated to the old Madison Square Garden and today is located in the lobby of "new" Madison Square Garden. By the way the retail cost of that original cap was $4.95.

                        As to the accuracy of the Chris Creamer Giants logo of 1933-1936 the Giants of that era simply never wore that logo. The 1948 - 1957 logo was similar to the Giants logo of the period, but again, just look at some pictures of that era and decide for yourself. It was several years ago that I provided that website with the logo that you see above. They in turn adopted the Giants various color schemes to the logo to take you through the years that those caps were in use. Prior to that they used the same logos shown in the 1933-36 and 1948-57 to cover those various eras.
                        If your still interested in various caps and logos from different eras try Cooperstown Ballcaps website at: http://www.cooperstownballcap.com/
                        RCL

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by [email protected] View Post
                          He first relocated to the old Madison Square Garden and today is located in the lobby of "new" Madison Square Garden.
                          Never knew Gerry Cosby was a former player. When i saw "Gerry Cosby and Company" on the outside of 2 Penn Plaza for the very first time I thought it was an accounting firm or something like that, that just happened to luck out locationwise. (There are plenty of accounting firms, law firms, &c. whose name is that of the head guy plus "and company.")

                          Incidentally, Gerry Cosby is no longer in the lobby of the present MSG. They are moving to a location at 11 Penn Plaza, on 31st Street just east of 7th Avenue, and they hope to open at that location in the fall, according to their website. (11 Penn Plaza is one of the two buildings across 7th Avenue from Penn Station; the other, of course, is the Hotel Pennsylvania.) If memory serves me right, MSG is going to use the Cosby space as part of their renovation/expansion project.
                          If you've been wanting to send someone a thumbs-down, opportunity knocks! I'm now on Cameo, and I'm ready to send a personalized thumbs-down to anyone you want!

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                          • #14
                            Thanks for the information Gary. Living in Florida for the last several years unfortunately takes you out of the loop. I took a look at the Cosby website and it looks as if that move is imminent but the business still remains in the family. Incidentaly, if you visit there website it will give you the complete lowdown on Gerry Cosby, the teams he played/worked for and his several contributions to professional hockey. I believe he is also a member of the Hockey Hall of Fame. Quite a legacy!
                            RCL

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                            • #15
                              They were already wearing that logo on their unis during the early Mathewson years...

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